I was thrilled to sit down and talk with experimental electronic music artist John McNally, AKA “twoleggedzoo” about his brand-new album, Introspective Reflections. McNally is a Champaign-Urbana mainstay in the ambient and immersive music scene, who’s always got new ideas for collaborations, along with a refined and adventurous musical sensibility. It was very enjoyable to talk with McNally about his music, his upcoming projects, and his background, plus it was fun to notice that we both coincidentally wore orange-framed sunglasses to the interview.
The interview has been edited for length and clarity.
Smile Politely: How did the album release party go last weekend?
John McNally: Oh, it went extremely well! It was really heartwarming because one of the hardest but most important lessons I’ve ever learned about making music is that just because you work really hard and spend a lot of time on something, that doesn’t mean anyone will interact with it in any way. And we’re so inundated with options for entertainment in Champaign-Urbana; I love how diverse and vibrant our scene is. You’re never going to be the only thing happening in town. So when people do show up, it’s extremely moving to me, and I’m grateful for that.
SP: It’s true that you can work so hard on a project and it will not get anyone’s attention.
McNally: Yeah, definitely. I think part of that stems from art becoming “content.” It just scrolls by on your phone and you spend seven seconds looking at something someone might have spent years making. There’s also the fact that music-making tools are more accessible than they’ve ever been, so there are more people putting music out into the world than there’s ever been. Which is a good thing, but it makes it very saturated.
SP: But you feel like you’ve found a kind of niche here?
McNally: Yeah, I do. I spent years honing my craft, writing songs, building sets, spending 40 hours practicing and then dragging my gear out to play for five to ten people in a basement. And at some point I realized that I make music for me first, and I’m just really happy if people care. It’s not about the people who didn’t come; be grateful for the people who do come, whether it’s five people or 50 or 500.
SP: Who do you collaborate with as an artist?
McNally: I have my core group of friends that I collaborate with; we call ourselves “the Lab-rarians.” We did “the expansion experience” together, and the dome shows, starting with Immersion Fest 2019.
SP: Oooh! Is Immersion Fest going to happen again?
McNally: I can’t commit to too much, but yes Immersion Fest will happen again this year. Back in 2019 you might have seen me play a set in the ambisonic dome.
SP: Yes, it was really cool! Lots of multimedia stuff was happening too.
McNally: Yeah, we probably spent 50 or 60 hours — I lost count — on installation, and I built the speaker mounts with my dad in my backyard. I’m really inspired by the power of collaboration, so getting people to pool our resources and build an experience together…that always feels the best.
SP: You have an album coming out, Introspective Reflections, that was created as a mixtape, right?
McNally: Yeah, it was a DJ mix submission for a festival, and I used the deadline for that submission to finish the album. Because I need deadlines, or else I’ll just get lost in the infinite possibilities. It’s really easy for me to get lost in all the possibilities in a digital audio workstation, so I enrolled in an online course for mixing and mastering, and I was like, “I am finishing this by this date.” It’s a project that’s also been in the works with Matt Harsh, a visual artist who made the projections at the show last night. We’ve been working on versions of this since 2019.
SP: It’s a really lovely track. How did you put it all together?
McNally: Some sections I wrote just because I was feeling inspired; plus I took a lot of specific pieces I had written for art installations or festivals, like Summer Camp Music Festival, and a multichannel installation for the Boneyard Arts Festival. I shortened the pieces to find the best parts and edited them together to make one cohesive 28-minute piece of music. The complete piece itself is a reaction to our times, to being really busy and overloaded with content, noise, and stimulation all the time. So Introspective Reflections intentionally lacks a narrative, because it’s supposed to create space for the listener to go on their own journey, to give them time and space to think and relax. That’s where the nature-based visuals play into it.
SP: I also want to mention that the art projections at the album release show by Matt Harsh were really cool.
McNally: We’re planning to use the music and visuals for some immersive art installations and deep listening sessions around Champaign. We’ll have the sound system set up so people can sit quietly and look at the visuals, and the purpose will be intentional listening and relaxation.
SP: I’d really enjoy that. I like the idea of creating music that offers the listener the chance to reflect on what they’re hearing.
McNally: It’s space for you, the listener. It’s intentionally lacking in bass because I wrote it for smaller spaces, like headphones, small rooms, and gatherings.
SP: I thought the whole album could have gone on much longer!
McNally: Well, for each passage, it just felt like the right length of time. I usually end up going through a questioning phase while editing where I’m like “Is this any good? I need to set this down and walk away.” It’s an important part of the process.
SP: I know that questioning feeling. Does anyone listen to your music while you’re working on it, to give you feedback?
McNally: Yes! More now than before. It’s great to have a fresh pair of ears on something, someone who’s not personally attached to it. They’ll point something out and I’ll be like, “I’ve listened to this 10,000 times and I didn’t hear that.” I’m in a Discord group and it’s a really positive community where you can post works-in-progress.
SP: That’s awesome. How can people hear your album?
McNally: It’s on all the major streaming services. Also, we’ll be at the Boneyard Arts Festival [April] 12th and the 13th as an immersive art installation at the old ReStore building [on University Avenue, Champaign]. We’re going to build a big “U” of screens with projections so you can walk through and it’ll be an experience.
Check out John’s work and learn more on Instagram or Spotify.